In my blog posts, I tend to avoid addressing personal matters and observations not rooted in concrete fact. However, PIAW left a provocative comment on my last post, Hitler and Homework. The subject is something that I have often wondered about. I decided to muse aloud instead of burying my response in the comments section. I will record my impressions (some of them from long ago) from personal experience, anecdotal evidence and common sense, unsubstantiated by statistics or any other verifiable data. I am open to hearing all sides of this issue.....
"PIAW:
I can understand where you saw the irony of the juxtaposition of the two stories, although I myself didn't connect the two events when I wrote the post. But I see your point about the dangers of incuriosity.
I presumed that Tutor Vista will be required to operate within the guidelines of the US school curriculum. I doubt that as outsourcers, they will be at liberty to redesign the content of the study material.
The Hitler incident is appalling of course and I wholly concur with your opinion that it is a result more of ill education than a lack of education.
India's laser like focus on science and technology (and bookish achievements) is a bit scary - and I say this as a student of science. I do believe that science, technology and commerce are the sure fire path for a country to extricate itself out of poverty and social / cultural stagnation. But it should not be at the expense of a humane and ethical understanding of the world. Education is not only a means to feed the body. In its preferred essence, it ought to also enrich the soul.
The trend however is not wholly new. India's eagerness and enthusiasm to define its own destiny after independence was understandable. So was the need to have a fresh and forward looking start after a long and humiliating foreign occupation culminating in the bloody and cataclysmic partition of India. An educational system which encouraged cutting edge science and technology was a commendable effort towards that goal. Massive national resources were poured into the establishment of the world famous IITs (Indian Institutes of Technology), The All India Institute of Medical Sciences and numerous other science, engineering and medical institutions. Older research institutes like the Tata Institute of Fundamental Research and the Indian Institute of Science in Bangalore saw their prestige soar. Middle and high school curricula were modernized and the National Science Talent Search program was introduced to identify scientifically gifted students and catch them young right at the middle and high school level. There is no doubt that this energy and effort bore fruit in as much as India started graduating top notch scientists, doctors and engineers at least from among the urban privileged class. But did this success come at the cost of something vital which defines a nation's character and values?
The implicit caste system dividing science, commerce and humanities (in that order) was evident even when I was a student many decades ago. It was automatically assumed by most parents and teachers that the best students (the bias was not so strong towards girls as it was for boys) in high school were going to choose science, followed by commerce. The rest would study the humanities. I remember that it was only the very confident and ambitious boy who would choose to study history or English despite having secured good grades. And that choice too was very often motivated by an intention of eventually entering the prestigious Indian Administrative Service or the Indian Foreign Service - the next best thing (sometimes better) to being a doctor or an engineer. So in effect, the wish to become a super bureaucrat drove many of these bright students to the humanities rather than the love of the discipline.
Having opted for science in high school, I was shut out from learning anything except physics, chemistry and mathematics from age fourteen. A few compulsory courses in English language and literature broke the monotony of the pure science rhythm somewhat in high school. The only "choice" I had from ninth grade onwards was between biology and engineering drawing. In college, English too was jettisoned after a cursory first year course which I had to merely "pass" and it didn't even figure in my transcript as a subject taken.
While I enjoyed my science education for the most part, I also desperately missed studying Bengali, taking an art class in college and if possible, learning a bit of history and philosophy. The opportunity was not there. My love of literature and art was indulged in my own time, fueled by my own enthusiasm and the encouragement of my parents. Many of my friends who were "good" science students seemed to know very little of the world outside the text book and the laboratory. Neither did they care very much about broadening their horizons.
My children on the other hand, were educated in the US and had quite a different experience. Having followed a very similar path in high school - of math, science, social studies, English and assorted AP courses, they took different routes in college. My daughter graduated with a major in philosophy but took college classes in organic chemistry, physics, linear algebra and statistics although she was not required to. Conversely, my son, whose primary major was chemistry, undertook a second major (risking a brutal study load) in an integrated liberal arts degree, thus adding English, economics, history and philosophy to his course load. He even took a credit course in Indian classical music for one semester so he could play the tabla which along with the piano, he loves. This diversified approach in both their cases was instrumental in achieving a broader perspective than the narrow focus which the science curriculum in India offered me. In the case of my daughter, science and math honed her analytical skills in philosophy. In the case of my son, the liberal arts education helped keep his reading, writing and critical thinking skills intact. Also, I suspect it happily broke the monotony of a monolithic, cubicle approach to higher education. When my children shared with me their choice of courses every semester, I used to feel as excited as they did. At the same time I felt a twinge of regret and envy that I myself had missed the opportunity of sampling such a delicious smorgasbord of educational choices in my own college days.
Recently, on a visit to New Delhi, I had a revealing conversation with a neighbor who teaches philosophy in a college in Delhi University. The decline in the popularity of philosophy among Indian students is perhaps the biggest indicator of how utilitarian Indian education has become. During my parents' college days, philosophy attracted the best and the brightest among Indian students. It was considered at par with physics, chemistry and mathematics as a worthwhile and challenging discipline. In the last forty years or so, this "non-practical" intellectual pursuit has seen a precipitous slide in its popularity and prestige. My neighbor, the philosophy professor said that her teaching experience was akin to a stint in the purgatory - a punishment for both the teacher and the taught. The students in her philosophy class were unmotivated and unqualified. Most alarming was the fact that these students were in the class only to earn an "easy" B.A. while devoting most of their energies to train for lucrative but mind numbing jobs at various "call centers" which dot the cityscape. They had enrolled in the philosophy program only because it was possible to get into it with mediocre grades. A philosophy major occupies the lowest notch on the current Indian academic totem pole, along with Sanskrit and other Indian languages.
I should note here that like philosophy, natural sciences too are suffering a set back in Indian higher education. During my college years, philosophy had already fallen into a second tier status but was not quite scraping the bottom of the barrel as it is now. The sciences however, physics and chemistry in particular, attracted the cream of the crop among Indian college students - many of them foregoing a career in medicine or engineering in favor of basic science. But recently I learnt that basic science too now suffers from the same "undesirable" stigma as philosophy. The best and the brightest are opting for the more "useful" applied sciences like computer science, medicine and engineering or lucrative degrees in business and finance. India and Indians are justifiably proud of the achievements of their doctors, engineers and businessmen. But a huge nation without philosophers and ethicists? Without vigorous basic research in the sciences? Becoming a giant clearing house for money, products and services? No place and need for ideas? Is that good? Should that be desirable? Or does India, in its breathless pursuit of a seat at the global table, not have the time or the patience for purely intellectual flights of fancy?
I'd like to hear what others think. I left India a long time ago. My perspective may be dated, aged and unrealistic. It will be useful to hear from those who are more intimately familiar with the educational trend in India either through their own experience or by having interacted with others who came out of that system recently. Especially useful will be to hear from younger folks.
Gawker, Devan, Prasad, (or anyone else who may be reading silently) if you are reading - what do you guys hear or think? Please enlighten me.
My own impression, formed in the recent years through interaction with family members and friends still in the educational system or just coming out of it, is that the field of opportunities has broadened, not narrowed to just medicine/engineering/call centre type jobs. My niece landed a job as a trainee in an advertisement agency just within weeks of graduating with a B.A. in Visual Communications ( majoring in graphic arts, media and communications, film making,etc.) My sister, on the flip side, majored in Electronics and Communications engineering, but is working with mainframes (not really related to her major) in Infosys for the last couple of years. She has plans to do an MBA after working for some more years. The current ( and in my opinion, realistic) focus for many young people is to plan to get a job to (1) pay off bills/family obligations (2) pursue the real desires of the heart as a hobby rather than a vocation. Some of them even make a switch in careers many years later, as did my friend, who abandoned her B.E in Computer Sci and M.S in the same to switch to being a psychologist working with trauma victims.
Perhaps there is hope for the survival of philosophy, literature, fine arts and the like, if only as much loved hobbies or second careers for those inclined to pursue them in depth.
You might want to look at this rather hopeful view of the new generation of India's talent pool for another take on the subject of whether turning India into a nation of call centre/ repetitive programming drudgery is taking a different direction.
Posted by: Sujatha | August 24, 2006 at 06:31 AM
Ruchira,
Great post. I enjoyed reading it and could relate to almost all the points it made. I too took science in school and later college and IIT. I was a recipient of the prestigious National Science Talent scholarship. So, I am a huge beneficiary of the Indian government's emphasis on science education. And I am both grateful for that and aware of the emphasis that the enitre Indian society placed on science education.
My observation about the connection between the two disparate threads in your previous blog post (on which I commented) was an ironic one, and yes, perhaps somewhat of a stretch.
My point was not so much that the outsourced education providers will have a say in the curriculum of American schools, but that blindly accepting their ideas of educational success would not be productive in the right way.
Friends from Mumbai, who have a ten year old son visited us a few months ago. They described the tough schedule of their son's school days: after school he goes to coaching class almost every night and on weekends. The kid has a talent for tabla, but there is "no time" for classes. They conceeded that the educational system when we were growing up (in the 60s/70s) was more rational and manageable compared to the hell that it has become now.
Ironically, I have come to my jaundiced view of the Indian educational system in the years that I have lived here in the States. Partly because I have seen how my kids are taught and the critical thinking ability they develop. More importantly, I have encountered a broader cross-section of Indians here than I would have in India. Consider:
1. An IIT graduate who believes in a guru who can perform miracles.
2. Another IIT graduate who believes that it is not the role of govt. to help poor people.
3. Too many who believe that the Indian system of affirmative action is wrong. In my view it is deeply flawed, but something like that is necessary to help the people who are on the lowest rungs of society.
I could go on, but you get the idea.
Each time Tom Freidman writes about the exalted Indian and Chinese school systems, I feel as if nails are being drawn on a chalkboard.
Posted by: PIAW | August 24, 2006 at 06:35 AM
Cool analysis - will reply in detail later.
-P
Posted by: Prasad | August 24, 2006 at 11:47 AM
The hitlers cross ured restaurant is currently beign featured on our local abc nighty news channelhere in DC .check more at http://abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory?id=2346673&page=1
Posted by: Amita | August 24, 2006 at 09:38 PM
Ruchira,
One of your relatives-- Kaka's brother-in-law was nicknamed Hitler. The point is that for most Indians, illiterate and semi-literate that they are and overwhelmingly young, they simply associate Hitler as a "strong man"-- a person who will set things right. They simply don't relate to WWII, leave alone the Holocaust. There aren't too many Hitlers around but the number of people named Stalin is not insubstantial.
Posted by: manoj | August 25, 2006 at 12:04 AM
Manoj,
Thanks for reminding me of that bit of colorful family history! That Hitler was born in the 1940s well before the Indian independence and before the extent of Nazi atrocities was common knowledge. His parents, Indian nationalists, were inspired by Netaji's abortive efforts to join forces with the Germans to beat the British. Had they known what we now know, I am sure they wouldn't have chosen it, even as a nick-name. By the way that Hitler grew up to be a dedicated Marxist and used to joke that his political beliefs were the biggest revenge for his misguided name!
Posted by: Ruchira Paul | August 25, 2006 at 12:32 AM
Hi - this is such a peevy subject, because I am not able to decide whether I should explain why the education system in India is the way it is or talk about the new opputunities that are coming up for the younger folks, which means that they need not be tied up so geeky professions.
Also - please, show me how many people are able to make a better living by choosing the liberal arts either in India or even USA for that matter.
As humans, we are genetically programmed to work and produce - arts be damned, I like my economy be decided by science and technology only than anything else. :)
Posted by: Prasad | August 25, 2006 at 01:06 AM
Definitely an excellent, insightful post.
Perhaps the impressions of an ex-IITian on his alma mater might resonate?
http://www.shunya.net/Pictures/NorthIndia/Kharagpur/Kharagpur.htm
Posted by: NA | August 25, 2006 at 03:35 AM
NA:
Thanks for reading and providing the link to your own walk down the memory lane. Those are some excellent observations.
I wonder how many Indian students even go through the same doubts and misgivings about the quality of their education that you, PIAW and I have experienced? Does the promise of a bright and lucrative future cloud other concerns? And perhaps the second thoughts and regrets for a youth flown by without smelling the roses come a bit later - in middle age? Or perhaps not at all.
Again, thanks for the insight. Hope to "see" you again at Accidental Blogger.
Posted by: Ruchira Paul | August 25, 2006 at 09:26 AM
NA:
I noted with some amusement and interest that you too used the word "incurious" in your article - same as PIAW did in her comment. A great word to describe the pathology of self satisfaction.
Posted by: Ruchira Paul | August 25, 2006 at 09:31 AM
Prasad:
You may have interpreted my post as "anti- science & technology," which it is not. I am a huge fan of science, rationality and the "no crap" thinking style. I have never had any doubt about the benefits to a society which values scientific thinking and applications. For the most part, I define progress and productivity by that yardstick. In fact I believe that our political system wouldn't be such a mess if more scientists, engineers and doctors ran for public office instead of the current crop of airheads and obscurantists who populate the political scene.
My post was directed more towards an education system which puts blinders on the eyes of students at a very early age - sometimes turning them into glorified technicians rather than independent thinkers. It is very disappointing to encounter a seemingly (and often certified) "sharp" mind which does not ( or cannot) stray beyond the strict boundaries of its own learned expertise. A scientist with an appreciation of history, politics, literature and even the fine arts, is unquestionably a better member of society - perhaps even a better scientist. Similarly, I fully expect students of liberal arts to better excel in their fields when they have a reasonable understanding of the sciences.
I was lamenting the lack of an integrated approach in Indian education which compartmentalizes too much, making communication across the divides an impossibility. That increases the danger of scientists turning into socially and culturally stilted automatons. And the non-scientists become pseudo-intellectual windbags who must cover up their ignorance with bluster. Not a good thing for a healthy national conversation.
Posted by: Ruchira Paul | August 25, 2006 at 03:18 PM
John Adams, the 2nd US president wrote in a letter, to his wife Abigail Adams:
"I must study politics and war that my sons may have liberty to study mathematics and philosophy. My sons ought to study mathematics and philosophy, geography, natural history, naval architecture, navigation, commerce and agriculture in order to give their children a right to study painting, poetry, music, architecture, statuary, tapestry, and porcelain."
The US is on the third phase of its evolution as a culture and civilization and India in the second.
Posted by: Padma | August 28, 2006 at 10:04 AM
Interesting as John Adams' description of the evolution of education is, I do not agree with him.
The acquisition of human knowledge is an on going process - each generation must learn anew and become the repository for the next one. Surely, we must pick and choose as we go along. Much ancient wisdom is obsolete and unnecessary to pass along. However, at no stage of human civilization, do we have the luxury to learn math / philosophy at the expense of politics, war and peace. Nor should we relegate philosophy and science to the dust heap of history in favor of poetry and porcelain.
The point of my post was that lacking a genetic memory of all things learnt in the past, humans are condemned / blessed to learn anew what their ancestors had also struggled with - albeit with better tools. A society must strive to keep all its engines well oiled and firing - at all times. Sure, science and technology take precedence in modern society over philosophy, poems and pottery. But not wholly. My point was that India is not really in Adams' stage II - geography, natural history and philosophy do not unfortunately figure prominently in the scheme of things. It is also wrong to say the US is in stage III - at least I hope not! A society of only poetry and porcelain in the absence of mathematical precision and scientific pragmatism, even figuratively, is not the most vibrant form of existence.
As I said, let all branches of human endeavor be kept alive, if possible. A system which allows all those disciplines listed by Adams to flourish simultaneously and nourish each other, is the most wholesome ideal in my opinion.
I am afraid that with an ignorant and belligerant leadership currently in power, we may be sliding back to warfare as our primary national pursuit in the US.
Posted by: Ruchira Paul | August 28, 2006 at 12:56 PM